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Take a moment and ask yourself why…
I struggled with whether to post this here or at I Should Be Writing, but I figure this isn’t about writing, this is about dealing with readers/listeners. I wonder if I should be posting it at all, but I also worry that Twitter didn’t allow me to express myself fully enough last night. So I want to talk about stuff here without the limitations of Twitter.
Yesterday I got some correspondence that baffled me. Someone heard me interviewed on a podcast and wanted to contact me, but most of the letter concerned why he wasn’t going to listen to my books. In detail. But, he says, he wants to be my friend because he’s an aspiring writer.
I am so flummoxed I don’t know what to say. Here’s the deal: I understand that there are thousands of free audiobooks out there. And thousands of podcasts. And websites and tv shows and families and travel and cooking and politics and sports and dogs and cats and arguments about pies vs tarts. I understand that many people can’t listen, and that many people often prioritize other things over my work. I also am not so mind-bogglingly egotistical that I think my books will appeal to every single person that comes along. So if I ask someone if they listen, and they say no, I am not bothered, hurt, or need more information. (incidentally, I usually ask someone if they listen as a contextual part of a conversation, say, about podcasting or promo creation or writing/plotting. Someone wants to ask me a question on how I plot my books, so I pick something of my own to use as an example, but want to make sure they’ve read/heard it to make sure they’ll follow, for example.)
But I have had people go through the trouble to contact me and tell me why they don’t listen. And I honestly have no clue why they do this. None. Maybe they think I need to know. Maybe they think I will only correspond with actual fans of my work, and fuck all the rest of you. But really all they’re doing is confusing me at best and upsetting me at worst.
I just need to make a couple of things clear- because there are some fine lines here. I am not upset that people don’t listen. They can even go so far as to tell me they don’t listen, if it fits the context of the email. I just don’t need to know why. I don’t understand why people would do that, what their goals are, how they expect me to react.
This issue is up there with the people who tell me when they didn’t like a podcast or a story or a book. They’re entitled to their opinion, I certainly don’t begrudge them that, but I don’t understand why I need to know about it. Do they want me to edit? Never write something like that again? I don’t get it. And again, the fine line here is I have no problem with reviews, good or bad, because that’s commentary on the novel for the benefit of other readers. I have no (and expect no) control over that. And if someone wants to ask me, “why did you do X in this story?” then I might enter that dialog. But someone just telling me directly, “I didn’t like that,” what is their goal? I honestly don’t understand. I’d much rather someone blog about it, open a conversation, allow other readers/listeners to talk about it. There are forums, communities, blogs, all sorts of stuff.
I’m reminded of the story Connie Willis told in the video interview I did with her in May. How someone flat out told her that she hadn’t written anything good since her first novel. Why would he say that? What was his goal?
So that’s my beef today. And my plea- before you email me to tell me why you’re not listening or why you didn’t like something, ask yourself, first, why you’re doing it, and what you hope to get out of it. Who knows, maybe someone can explain to me in the comments why it would benefit me to listen to these emails, even welcome them, but at the moment, I don’t even know how to respond (beyond something akin to the polite form “thanks for writing” email).
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28 Responses to Take a moment and ask yourself why…
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Categories
The Latest from I Should Be Writing- Fun website stuff February 1, 2012
- A different writing challenge January 31, 2012
- ISBW Special #46 – Stonecoast Writer’s Residency January 30, 2012
- Notice- No interviews for a while January 30, 2012
- Eligibility in Hugos and Campbells January 24, 2012
Appearances
I look at it as extreme egotism on their part. They expect their opinion to actually matter to you, and they’re probably incapable of understanding why it wouldn’t. I can’t remember where I first heard this, but someone very smart once described people like this as existing inside their very own URAMA field. URAMA = Universe Revolves Around My Asshole.
That’s the only explanation I can come up with.
Sadly, I think it’s a self image thing. Not necessarily tearing down others to make oneself feel better (although that happens far too often as well), but rather an effort to feel needed or important. If no one asks them for their opinion, they might feel somehow obligated to share it anyway. I think deep down they hope that their input will change the recipient’s behavior, somehow validating their own sense of self.
That’s my nugget of psychobabble wisdom for the day.
I can’t make time to listen as much these days, but I did finish PFK in print last week and enjoyed it a lot. Thanks!
I recently had someone complain about the music choice in my podcast, and said that they disliked it enough to make them want to quit listening.
They clearly wanted me to change my intro/outtro music. I simply told them I chose that music because it pleased me to do it, and that I would be keeping it. Sometimes a reader or listener wants you to change something. Just say that you’re producing the best work you know how and that your choices are YOUR choices. If they think they can do better, they should write or record their own work.
And you know what? Lots of writers get started that way. They read something and say, “Wow, that was done wrong, I could do better.” So think of it as an opportunity to invite more people into the writing or podcasting world.
Why I don’t Listen.
I have about 5 days of Audio to get through, already downloaded. I’ve been working on my book and Making Phone calls. I can’t listen, and pay attention to both, to Spoken word when I write. 3k in the last weekend is good for me.
I certainly not understand why people would do this. Maybe they have no concept of what a leap it is to take something you have written and spent so much time on and a good part of your soul.
I think all pod casters and podiobooks I listen to are phenomenal. As a disabled person, it is hard to hold a book to read now, and without podiobooks and authors such as you my life would very dull indeed.
Don’t even read this emails. Not worth the time. All they are is depressing. Sounds like they are jealous they cannot write and podcast as well.
On another note, my New Years resolution is to call on voice mail all the podcasts I listen to and give kudos or constructive criticism. As well as to write reviews and vote more on podcasts I love.
Don’t let the B@st@rds get you down!! You rock woman.!!
Hi Mur,
I guess I have somewhat mixed feelings on stuff like this. I don’t mind people telling me they didn’t like something I wrote, as long as they can tell me _why_ they didn’t like it. I guess it’s a matter of constructive criticism. I may or may not choose to accept that criticism, but at least they’re (theoretically) trying to help in that case.
Sometimes it’s also a matter of personal taste, and that’s fine by me too. What really, REALLY gets me angry, though, is when people feel that their tastes are the be-all end-all of criticism. That everyone should agree with their enlightened opinion that they’re so magnanimously gracing you with. Ugh.
In my writers’ group, I read a lot of stuff I don’t like. But if I mention that fact at all, I make a point of separating out the fact that just because I didn’t like it doesn’t mean it’s _bad_. Something can be fantastic, but just not appeal to my tastes, and that’s fine! I also don’t generally say anything to that effect unless asked, since I’m not so egotistical as to think the author cares about my personal aesthetic.
So yeah, this comment is getting a little out of control. Anyway, don’t let the bastards get you down. Letting this asshat ruin your day is just letting him win: sounds like he’s so miserable about his own lackluster writing career that he feels the need to share.
Don’t forget that you’re a published novelist now with an excellent debut novel, not to mention one of the acknowledged leaders of a podcasting community with tons and tons of dedicated fans! If one person doesn’t want to listen to you, well, his loss.
Quote From Nobilis “And you know what? Lots of writers get started that way. They read something and say, “Wow, that was done wrong, I could do better.” So think of it as an opportunity to invite more people into the writing or podcasting world.”
That is what I did, I heard a story on escape pod that I didn’t particularly like, I don’t even remember which one, and I said, I can do better than that. So I did, and I took it a step further and challenge to my listners / reader, if you think you can do better… I figure if it worked to get me writing again, maybe I will inspire someone else.
Enough about me. I agree that, if someone does not like or does not want to listen to something that’s fine, just say, hey I don’t like that. If you have constructive advice, sure, but otherwise move along. If you are complaining just for the sake of complaining what is the point.
Mur, thanks for posting this. It is funny how often, things that you post are things that are on my mind.
Hey Mur,
Your post reminds me of one I read on Neil Gaiman’s blog. Scroll down to the second email received, in bold. Imagine the nerve. Not just saying why you wont read it, but also a double dose of “fuck you” to complete the package.
http://journal.neilgaiman.com/2008/07/roof-of-all-evil.html
I have no insight for you as to why people do this. Perhaps an inflated sense of entitlement?
I saw the tweets last night and of course this post this morning and I’ve been thinking about it for a while. Recently I’ve been dealing with someone who is doing the same thing to me and have many of the same questions as you. I’m not certain which is worse, whether you get odd or negative feedback like that or none at all.
Fortunately for you Mur, you are past the last stage and are getting some feedback. Unfortunately for you, every jackhole on the planet has a chance to make their voice heard and some of them should not out of common courtesy.
I don’t understand that mindset, and maybe it is as simple as them expecting you to change things to suit their tastes, but the more I think about it, the more I realize that this is simply someone who is expecting custom content to suit their desires and that is not your job.
Your job is to tell YOUR stories, and that is why you have the audience that you have earned. We come to hear your stories. That’s why we come and that’s why we stay. That’s why we buy the books, give feedback, contribute to projects like Stories of the Third Wave and that’s why you have so many fellow podcasters and authors willing to give up their time to help in recording projects like The Takeover.
Keep writing Mur, and realize that you have a faithful fanbase that enjoys your work. Don’t let this detractor get you down.
R
As hard as it may be, the best thing I think is to rise above, as my MIL always says, nod and thank them for their time…and forget about them.
There are plenty of us out here who never say a word (like me) who DO listen to your books, as well as your amazing podcasts–egads, you have no idea (until now!) just how helpful they were to me. Seriously. After a long period of non-writing after selling my first book, then my husband falling ill and passing away, I stumbled on your podcast and, well…I’m back to writing regularly again. I blame your podcast in no small part. LOL.
I agree with some above who say it is a problem on that person’s (and others like him) part. Some strange need. Emphasis on strange.
Glad you posted about it though. Hopefully these comments will help jump this hurdle and no one like that will ever make you feel like tearing your hair out again. Their loss, after all. I recommend your work to anyone I know who needs a boost, just to know they aren’t alone.
Carolyn
As a recovering local journalist, let me tell you, people are even _more_ willing to tell you whats wrong with your newspaper. It’s made even more disheartening when, most of the time, you agree with them. This is why I’m not a local journalist anymore. Fight the good fight, Mur.
Henlen’s Razor: Never attribute to malice what can be easily explained by stupidity. Oh sure, some of these guys are just flat out douchenozzles, but if I were a gambler I’d bet that a lot of them are young, and fairly new to the whole author correspondence thing. I know that the first few times I tried to get in touch with a writer I liked, I did a very good job of making an ass out of myself and umption (to steal that great line from The Long Kiss Goodnight). Heck, sometimes I still do. I mean, what kind of hubris did I have to have to think that, to pick a recent example, you would be so impressed with the iTunes playlist I made for my novel that I had to include a screencap image of the playlist to prove that I actually made it? I still feel like a dink for that one.
You know what confounds me the most about all this? That the person emailed, told you he heard you on an interview, told you he wasn’t going to listen to your stuff and *why* he wasn’t, then he asked if he could stay in contact with you? That’s just some batshit weird logic, there.
It’s one thing for people to tell you why your story didn’t work for them (I kind of appreciate knowing the why, but that’s my own thing). But it’s really unprofessional and a little bizarre for the person in the same email/correspondence/whatever to say they want to be your friend, after trashing your stuff.
As soon as I read this, I was reminded of the XKCD comic.
http://www.xkcd.com/481/
The only reason I could see being constructive criticism is if they tell the WHY they don’t like it. And frankly, I think that the two words should be used exclusively together, ‘constructive’ and ‘criticism’.
I’ve had customers return parts with ‘we don’t like it’, and when asked why, they couldn’t answer. Talking about 6 figure purchases as well. We are a funny breed of animal, us humans.
I wonder if, in some misguided way, he thought he was being honest and challenging you to the same honesty. Almost like — as you allude to above — “I want to talk to you about writing, but I am not a fan. Do you have the integrity to talk to me on the subject of writing after that declaration, or are you only looking to talk to sycophants and fans who want to talk about *your* work?”
Making that kind of assumption that you might be an egomaniac right off the bat speaks to where this person’s head is (i.e., projection). No doubt, this is someone who is very full of himself and thinks they are quite important, and wants to make sure you are on his level (or what he thinks of as his level) of professionalism about “the craft” before speaking with you so as not to waste his time. No doubt there is some jealousy here: “This Mur person can’t possibly be *this* popular and be nice. She must be a bitch or egomaniac or…well, no doubt LESS talented than *I* (sic) so *I* must set the rules of this conversation right off that bat.”
Don’t let it get you down.
I’m a very sensitive person. My first response to any negative criticism, even if part of it is positive, is to fall into despair. I’m pretty sure it’s the wrong thing to do, but that’s what I do. I can’t control how I feel, but I can control what I do about those feelings.
I would like to second what Jason R. wrote (well, part of it anyway). I know, as a writer, that my writing can always get better. I think I heard your hero Connie Willis say the same thing. For that reason, I listen to all criticism, and I think about it (after I’ve finished weeping;). I analyze it to see if there’s any credence in what they say. If there is, I try to apply it to my writing. If there isn’t then I dismiss what they person said/wrote.
That being said, when someone is willing to take the time to write a response to me, it means I’ve awakened his emotions to the point where he can’t hold them in anymore and has to share them. That means I’ve succeeded in my writing! My goal, with everything I write, is to tap into that deep well of feeling we all have and draw it out. If someone responds, it means I’ve done it.
Mur, you rock, and so does your writing! Whatever you hear, keep going. After all, You should be writing! In fact, so should I.
I personally have become a new fan over the summer. Been an amature poet/writer way longer than you been around, LOL, and a semi-proffessional musician since the age of seven. The one thing I’ve noticed is that people will go out of their way (mostly politely) to explain why they didn’t care for a poem a story a song and they are ever so careful to mention what a nice guy I am and how cool it is that I try. I think it’s a ‘human’ thing, I really do. Most of the time my response is ‘who asked you’? Deserves more thought though. Keep up the great work!
When I do my work, it is nice to get positive feedback from people who liked what I did.
Even more interesting and enlightening, though, is when someone tells me why they did not like what I did. This gives me the chance to think about their point of view, and look at it and the things they criticized from a few different angles. Sometimes I do not understand the criticism even after thinking about it, sometimes I understand where they come from, but do not agree with their point of view, and sometimes I understand their point and maybe change aspects of what I am doing.
So, I was surprised when I read:
> I just don’t need to know why.
Is not this the best type of feedback you can get? Information why someone does not experience satisfaction with some part of the work you do?
Now, even after having read your post twice, I may have missed the part where you said what were the reasons why they will not listen (and they sure are missing out on a lot of fun), but is all of this feedback really completely worthless to you?
My wife deals with this too. If she has not yet sent out an email and comes to me for input she is all ears about grammar or whatever. But if it already went out to a group and I was a recipient and I point out any errors she tells me: “I would just rather not know.”
As far as what to say back I have a few suggestions:
1. Well I didn’t write it for YOU! (snarky, not recommended)
2. Really? Thanks for the input but we did look at that part and didn’t see it that way.
3. I agree, but my characters don’t always do what I want them to.
4. Yeah, but I make a mean soufflee!
5. Buzz! Too late, the shot clock had run out on that one.
6. Hmm, wanna go ride bikes?
It kind of reminds me of the Douglas Adams book when Arthur Dent is stuck on earth in the distant past and a UFO lands and the alien disembarks only long enough to insult him and leave.
I guess the best thing you could say is that if they want things to go different it’s because they could not write the book you did. But that also means nobody could write the books they would so they should get out there and write one better if they can. Damon Knight often got some of his best stories by writing ones he had read the way they should have been (idea-wise, not same characters obviously) in his opinion.
The good news is your stories are impacting people to the degree that they are invested in them and even if it is sometimes backhanded it is a great compliment.
Cheers,
Jonathan Rock
Also, sorry to post again, but I think that if someone isn’t willing to read your stuff they really are not putting themselves in a position to learn from you. I know on ISBW you have a lot of great interviews, but the best way I know to learn from a writer I admire is to read her stuff and say, “How did this affect me so strongly, how did she do it?” And then look at the words on the page and figure it out. This will teach you much more than anything they say can, because it is not hidden text or anything. Everything they did to accomplish that feeling is right there on the page. Study what they did and how and ask them after that if you have trouble discerning the principles they tapped into.
Best Regards,
Jonathan Rock
This reminds me of crit groups where a “writer” would seek out/ask for crits but would outright say because of demands on their time returns would be very slow in return or not at all.
Hey Mur,
You are *not* alone! I, and from the above comments, others, are right there with you. We don’t get it either.
Just remember, there are lots more of us *not crazies* out here listening and reading your work — and enjoying it!
Keep it up!
Don’t let them get you down. Just know that there are a whole lot of people that adore you and your work. Do what makes you happy and you will be happy. Keep up the great work. I look forward to listening to your voice. You have been blessed with such tallent. Thanks for sharing it with us.
Late to the thread, but my $.02:
I’m kinda like one of *those* people, sadly, but have spared you (Mur) the email.
I used to listen to GeekFu (as well as ISBW), from long before to the Heaven series and through the Hell series. Since I have a LitCrit and philosphical background, I made all kinds of notes on the books’ plot lines, character development, style issues, theological and philosophical inconsistencies and had built up an extensive critique of the fictional world and your books about it. At first, I was thinking you might want to have the feedback, but then changed my mind.
During the podcasts, you’d profusely thank everyone for the positive feedback, the blog commenters would give you praise, and you’d even (eventually) get a couple of fairly awful “Heaven fanfic” to air as well, as tribute to your fans’ love of your work. That’s real dedication/fandom.
It occurred to me that if I were to send you the feedback (unsolicited) I would be pissing in your cornflakes. You had/have enough fans of the series and your work to make it all worthwhile for them and you, and I doubted you were going to consider any of the feedback. It’s really easy to hit “delete” on a long email from someone you don’t know, especially when you didn’t ask for it.
So I figured you should continue to do what you do: Have fun, make fans, make friends, make money, and I’d listen elsewhere, lest my temptation to critique overpower my better sense.
So, I’m not a “crazy,” “egomaniacal,” “stupid” or a “douchenozzle” for wanting to give feedback on art (as some of the commenters supposed), but I’m also not too much of a “fan” anymore.
Since you don’t want to know *why* am I not listening/reading/whatever, I won’t tell you that it’s for my own good, and puts less noise in your signal to noise ratio.
“I am not upset that people don’t listen. They can even go so far as to tell me they don’t listen, if it fits the context of the email. I just don’t need to know why.”
Negative feedback with no constructive value is pointless and is likely coming from someone with all of the personality traits described by the folks above. However, I am concerned that you seem to be uninterested in any constructive criticism as well. I know it’s hard to hear, but personally, I wouldn’t be able to grow and learn if all I ever heard was how awesome I am.
If someone takes the time to tell you why they aren’t listening/reading your work, then you might want to at least consider their points. You don’t have to do anything about them, but ignoring them won’t do you much good in the long run.
My point is that I can’t change the work once it’s published. When people tell me directly that they don’t like my stuff, I don’t understand their goals. I accept critiques of works in progress, and I appreciate and learn from criticism in reviews.
It’s the one-on-one aspect. I don’t know what I am supposed to say to what often comes across as a clumsy attack.
When I sit down with my boss for my annual review, we go over the things I did and talk about areas of improvement. At that point, there is little I can do to change how I implemented a project or completed a task, but I can apply what I learned from that conversation to future projects.
Your job is being a writer, like my job is being a librarian. Of course you can’t change what has already been published, but if someone offers you constructive criticism, it’s kind of like my annual review process.
I have some sympathy for your situation with the douchebag, though. At least, in my case, I have the benefit of HR guidelines that keep my boss from being a dick about it.
[...] month Mur Lafferty shared her confusion over a certain type of feedback she’d received from folks explaining in detail why they aren’t reading or listening to [...]